Following on from the first part of our Pro X Fader feature which showcased the various features of this new fader and the history and work behind it, we can now bring you a full q&a with the creators and developers of this product. With its imminent official release at PLASA in London next week, you can now find out in more detail who the people behind its inception and development are, how much work went into creating this new piece of kit, explanations of the various features behind it, details on the compatibility range and possible upgrades, the reason for its pricing and the next step for EB. The questions put forward were gathered by ourselves, Gizmo and Deft from Skratchworx and the public. They were answered by Siya (head of Eclectic Breaks), 2tall (one of the testers), Paul (Eclectic Breaks’ electronics engineer), John and Mike from Seltron and TKD, their Japanese partner. Hand in hand with this q&a you can check the world’s first review of the Pro X Fader over at Skratchworx.

Let’s start with a bit of history. Where did the idea for the Pro X Fade come from?

John - Seltron have had the idea to develop a long-life, versatile cross-fader for a while. They have been working with standard types for many years. Nothing was done until a chance meeting at the PLASA 2003 show when Siya visited our booth. During the rest of the show a lot of meetings took place and the idea for this crossfader was born.
During 2003/2004 a lot of research was carried out to determine the best specification needed for the DJ market. Once the initial specification was agreed upon samples were made from standard products, to test the theories. The initial samples were well received and a lot of input and feedback was received from the DJs at this stage; tooling was designed then manufactured, at the same time packaging was also designed. At every stage of the development, tests were carried out and more market research done until the ‘perfect’ crossfader (Pro-X) was produced.

Siya - I’m from the generation of DJs who had to have a more resourceful approach towards equipment. I’ve always made little modifications and repaired my old sound systems. I think every DJ has had an idea like this before but few have actually been able to make something of it.
Whilst we were exhibiting at the Plasa exhibition in 2003, I was walking around the other stands and came across the Seltron booth. I approached the guys, John and Mike Williams and it just clicked straight away. Unlike many other companies they were receptive. Most companies aren’t even interested.

Mike - When Siya approached us at PLASA 2003, from the outset I was immediately struck by his enthusiasm. On introduction, our range of current faders was discussed, however Siya’s mind then went into overdrive, and soon he had a full idea of creating our own crossfader, and each time he returned to our stand, he came back with more ideas. Spending time with Siya and the team at EB, I could see what a young, professional, dedicated team there was. DJs tend to get a lot of bad press and criticism; however in EB I saw something revolutionary.
After the show was over, we got together and started mapping our ideas together, to see what in fact was possible. We submitted these to our fader-manufacturing partner Tokyo Ko-On Denpa (TKD), and they too showed a great interest in the project. Within a few months we had some concept samples and in May 2004, when the Directors of TKD visited the UK, they brought with them the first samples of the new style fader, with the torque control and cut in adjustment. Through a lot of hard work between EB, Seltron and TKD we’ve managed to reach the point where we are today.

Why a crossfader and not some other accessory?

John - Seltron already had considerable experience in the fader market and this product was a natural extension to the range.

Siya - I don’t think there’s a DJ in the world who hasn’t wished they could have a reliable fader? Besides did you really expect a company by DJs for DJs to come out with some useless accessory like some marketing people have at other companies? Then get a big name DJ to endorse it?

Why did you choose to team up with Seltron and TKD for manufacturing and development?

Siya - Both John and Mike Williams have such valuable knowledge and experience of components. In fact their client list reads like a who’s who of quality manufacturers such as Avolites, Marshall Amplification and Solid State Logic. I really think you guys need to interview John, he’s like an audio components historian, over the years he’s helped many of the top engineers by supplying them with their components. I was overwhelmed by their combined knowledge of components, but most of all by their down to earth mentality, I really respect that.

John - Seltron and their US subsidiary “Sellmark Electronics, Inc” already had many years experience in the fader market. Once initial contact had been made between Eclectic Breaks and Seltron it was an obvious partnership to produce the exact fader required by the market.
TKD are world-renowned in Conductive Plastic technology and have been partners with the Seltron Group for over 25 years. Since many other products have been co-developed with TKD no other partner was considered, we already had the best available.
TKD were established in Japan in 1949 and the originator’s son is still Chairman. They developed a range of precision components and electronic instruments and eventually started to develop their conductive plastic technology for faders. They were already manufacturing custom-built consoles for the Japanese broadcast market. For the past 25 years or more, John Williams worked with TKD to produce the right product for the Western Pro-Audio market, at this time there was no competition to Penny and Giles, now Seltron are their major competition and in some markets have overtaken P&G. TKD already supply crossfaders to the world's biggest DJ mixer manufacturers, so the experience is already there.

Mike - Finding the interest from TKD was the icing on the cake. With the demise of other fader manufacturers, finding a proactive, understanding manufacturing partner was crucial. TKD are probably the world’s oldest audio component manufacturer with a 60-year history, and the last 25 years involved in the production of conductive plastic components. The history and experience was important, however TKD could also offer an understanding of the needs of the Pro X Fade development. EB and Seltron gave them product ideas and they turned these ideas into reality. The same can be said of the development of the motorised fader. Seltron found a demand for the automation of recording consoles. There was nothing suitable in the market place, so they worked with TKD on its development, and a few months later, the TKD motorised fader was born. It’s all about innovation. Innovation and vision, and the team of EB/Seltron/TKD have delivered this.

How did you combine the professional experience of people like Seltron with your end-user experience?

2tall - We just chilled with them really, we’re all humans at the end of the day, suits or no suits, it was simply a case of explaining what we wanted, its been a great learning process for all concerned I’m sure.

Siya - It was really organic and easy, we did what we do best and Seltron did what they do! TKD simply made it happen! Eclectic Breaks is made up of artists, DJs and producers. We’ve got a dysfunctional family vibe going on whereas Seltron is a family run organisation with clearly defined systems and procedures.

What type of contact did you choose to use for the fader and why?

John - Seltron and TKD were already supplying most of the worlds leading pro-audio manufacturers. Tests had been carried out, both in-house and by the manufacturers, which established that TKD had superior conductive plastic technology and had chosen the contact material and the design of the contact brushes with great care. Mackie had already tested the motorised faders for over 2 million operations without a problem so it was essential that the same technology be used in the Pro-X.

Mike - Conductive plastic tracks was the only way to go. The whole ethos behind the fader was to produce the “Rolls Royce” (or even Bentley Continental GT!) of analogue cross faders. With TKD, we knew we were working with a track that had been tested to 2 million operations and was still working. A key issue was that TKD are continually investing in new product design, while others are slowly moving out of the game. The TKD track has a feel and longevity second to none, important factors in our game plan.

What is the initial range of mixer compatibility and what will be the future range?

Siya - Practically any 45mm fader with a 50k resistance value. So at the moment this would relate to a whole range of Vestax mixers including Pro Series 05/06/07, Numark, Stanton, Allen and Heath, Rane Empath, Gemini, Tascam etc. What we are doing is supplying the correct wiring configuration and faceplates for a mixer, so all the customers need to do is check the sticker on the box for compatibility with their mixer, as wiring configurations and faceplates vary from mixer to mixer.

Mike - We’ve first opted to go with 50K, as this is where the highest demand is.

Where and when do you intend to stop with the compatibility?

Siya - As long as there is a demand we will supply, obviously with the tooling up costs this means we’ll have to be realistic. If 10 people are asking us to make it compatible with an obscure mixer then it’s simply not viable!

Mike - It’s no use going for an obscure resistance taper and value, as the whole idea is to service the mass market. That said, if we find a high enough demand, we can also manufacture to meet these market needs. It’s all about listening to the DJs and what they actually want. This has been neglected for too long.

What work was involved in testing the compatibility, ensuring that the Pro X Fade would get the best result for each brand and mixer type?

2tall - We had contacts at retail shops, who kindly let us open up mixers and try them out, we tested dozens of mixers to find out just how far we can reach out to the DJs. The retailers also helped us with the market research, advising us on which products were the best sellers.

In your opinion which crossfaders does the Pro X Fade have more similarity with?

Siya - I would say it’s unique in that it’s got the best features of all the best faders in one. For instance I like the fader on the Rane 56 but you cant adjust the feel of it. The Pioneer 909 mixer stem looks to me like it’s gonna snap, as it’s only 4mm and looks real costly for a replacement. I like the feel of the PCV faders in those Technics mixers but it’s got that optical pop! Focus faders need a lot of getting used to, Alps faders bleed, break and are difficult to clean, Penny and Gilles snap and stick if lubed… I could go on and on!

2tall - I think it feels a bit like the Ecler fader actually but not so strict – it has some bend in it. The curve is similar to a PCV or a Penny & Gilles but it has a much shorter cut in time with our adjustments. The fact its analogue means you don’t get the popping sound that you get with optical faders.

Any plans for having upfader compatibility in the future or making a linefader version with some adjustments?

Siya - I can confirm that Line Faders will be our next product!

What’s the strength of the fader? From your testing how many times can you cut before it breaks down?

Siya - Well the only way it’s going to break down is if you smash it up like this…

Hi res version: right click and save as

Believe it or not if you straighten the poles on this fader it still works! Look after your Pro X Fade and it really shouldn’t fail you. Be careful not to over maintain it. What I mean by that is if you get the perfect cut and tension, then don’t take it apart unnecessarily unless you need to clean it. Although we’ve put all these adjustable parts on it, use your common sense, this is a precision device after all.

John - This product has been designed on the back of years of design and manufacturing experience. We are using tried and tested technology in the product.

2tall - Daredevil is the most hardcore scratcher I know, he had an older prototype for over a year with no lube and he has only just needed to lube his.

How did you test the strength and resistance of the fader overall? Meaning both the actual resistance to it being battered and resistance to it being used frequently and heavily by scratch DJs, thus wearing it down quicker then a ‘normal’ user?

John - Again this has been achieved by using superior materials to the competition. All tried and tested

Siya - Firstly under factory conditions these have done in excess of 2 million cycles and then they got bored. But we said thanks for that but how will it fair in the hands of a professional DJ, who takes their mixer from studio’s to rehearsals to clubs or even teaches young kids with their mixer? At EB we do all these things, as we train DJs, promote club nights, DJ in bands, record scratches for people in different studios. Due to our close links with clubs we’ve managed to road test it at venues such as Bar Rumba and Herbal in London, where some of the biggest names in club land come and play. I thought that was a really good way of testing the faders amongst a whole variety of DJs not just scratch DJs.

2Tall - We also just cut the hell out of it as much as possible, there’s a number of well known DJs we gave prototypes to and they all love it.

If possible can you detail some of the technology used in making this fader? Is there a part of the manufacturing or technology used that makes the fader better then say P&G or Focus which can be seen as your most direct competition? Some sort of secret ingredient?

TKD - 1 - Shaft: TKD have developed a special ‘super-grinding’ technology, which produces a very accurate component with a superior finish on the surface of the shaft of the Pro X Fade. This technology improves the ‘feel’ of our fader.
2 - Shaft Carrier: TKD have continually researched materials for the shaft carrier and have developed a special metal-plastic double layer shaft carrier which gives great accuracy in production, improves the ‘feel’ of the Pro X Fade and gives long life in operation.
3 - Conductive Plastic Technology: TKD are renowned specialist in CP technology, with a continuing Research & Development programme. The current CP technology has unique qualities in printing and moulding techniques only used on the TKD faders. By developing a mirror- finish resistance track, peculiar only to TKD’s CP technology, the Audio performance of the Pro X Fade is superior to other CP technologies and has been highly praised by the major Pro-Audio manufacturers. This technology also produces the superior ‘feel’ and extended life cycle.
4 - Slider (Brush): TKD have developed a high quality multi-fingered brush, using a combination of materials, which gives exceptional reliability in operation, very low electrical noise and a very smooth ‘feel’. The 11-finger brush has been developed in conjunction with the CP technology to produce the soft, smooth feel and a very long life cycle.
5 - Assembly and Production: TKD’s philosophy in production is “Technology cannot be seen, it must be touched, used and felt”. The TKD Engineers are aware that the fader becomes an integral part of the console and is one component which the user must be comfortable with. Therefore their philosophy is built into the fader. TKD continue to develop new products and improve technology where possible.

Mike - When we say pure conductive plastic tracks, we mean it. Other fader manufacturers have been known to pass off long life carbon as pure conductive plastic; however this just is not the case with us. What’s written on the box, is in the box!

How have you worked on making the price as affordable as possible without falling back on using cheaper/weaker materials?

Mike - From the outset, pricing was a key issue. We wanted to create a high quality product, but at the same time, something that gives the DJ value for money. After researching the market, it was obvious that the DJs had been ripped off for a number of years, having to buy inferior components at high prices. Up until now, there has not been an alternative, and the DJs have had to grin and bear it. From concept idea to an actual marketable product has taken two years, and during this time, every component that goes into the Pro X Fade kit has been thoroughly researched in terms of both price and quality. We believe our kit will leave the DJ truly happy with his purchase, and that’s what we want, happy DJs!

What about the market study you did on the other faders available today, can you detail that for us.

2tall - We just went out and found out as much as possible about the faders that are out there, from sizes to electronic properties, measuring everything to see what the best way of doing things was.

Did you test the other available faders and take in feedback from users and your own testers?

Siya - We tested as many faders as we could find… Feedback wise, it was good hearing everyone’s differing opinions on everything from feel and shapes of fader knobs to optical pops, etc. We went into a lot of depth but come out with one united opinion, in that there really wasn’t any analogue faders on the market that was up to the task.

2tall - We are constantly talking about the technology, and using all the various products as DJs, so all that came naturally to the DJs involved.

Could you also detail the testing of other crossfaders on the market, to what lengths did you go to test the various ones on offer?

2tall - We simply used our experience and knowledge really, other than that we looked at the electronics and the materials used, how strong they were, and also we looked at the reasons why other faders have problems and what those problems were.

What conclusions did you come to from studying the other faders available today and on what basis did you create the Pro X Fade?

John - We found that the quality of a lot of the faders in the market was poor, using out-dated carbon tracks. This is a substantial cost saving to OEM’s. The aim from day one was to offer a long-life and value for money. We felt that the DJs were being ripped off on the replacements and they replaced the fader far too often

Mike - The whole process of researching the competition was very far reaching. As well as looking at UK retail market, we visited stores in Europe, the USA and Asia. The majority of replacement crossfaders were sold in a plastic bag. Yes that’s it, £80.00 of your hard earned money gets you a low quality crossfader at a high quality price. We knew from road tests, that the replacement faders out there in the market, were just not up to the job. So many DJs are having to buy faders so regularly that the total cost far outweighed the actual cost of their mixer. From this, it was obvious we had to deliver a quality product, with quality presentation at a competitive price, and we firmly stand by this. It’s what we have delivered.

Did you take positive points from certain faders and incorporate them? Did you try to get around negative points from certain faders and if so how did you do it?

John - The only positive points we took was the fixing centres, the length of travel and the resistance values, otherwise none of the existing faders can match the superiority of the Pro X. Our competition will be trying to follow us (patents are involved however!)

Any plans to customise the fader and offer it to established mixer manufacturers?

Mike - As the Pro X Fade has evolved and we’ve been showing it at various trade shows, there has been a lot of interest from the DJ mixer manufacturers. They are keen for us to supply to them on an OEM basis. Of course, the current version maybe too “over-specced” for the manufacturers and they may require a fader with fewer features. We are willing to accommodate as much as possible, as we realise the manufacturers are an integral part of the business. As the Pro X Fade gains momentum, we can see the situation whereby the DJs are actually telling the mixer manufacturers that they should be using the Pro X Fade as their first choice or to offer it as an upgrade. It’s all a case of sitting down with the manufacturers and seeing exactly what they want. At the moment, our main focus is on the replacement fader package and once this is put to bed, we can discuss further with the OEMs.

Will you be able to buy individual parts for the fader like the P&G one? I saw that the rail is easily replaceable, is that correct?

John - The whole conception from day one was to produce a product, which had a long life and so there would be no reason to continually have to replace bits of it. The only reason we can see for other manufacturers offering spare parts is because they continually break down!

Mike - The fader has been built like a tank, and for something to go wrong would be rare. We’ve had beta test faders out on the road for over 1 year now, being hammered for hours on end by champion DJs and not a problem.

A bit of a blunt crunch question, but can you prove that it’s better than a P&G and for less?

Siya - The only proof will ultimately be in the pudding. I would urge everyone to simply try one out for themselves and compare.

Mike - For the last two years, we’ve been creating a fader that we firmly and honestly believe is number one. I wouldn’t knock the P&G faders at all, however the Pro X Fade is the next generation of analogue faders. Let’s remember, there is more to the Pro X Fade then just the fader. There is the whole concept of being able to retrofit the fader into many mixers. When you buy our fader, you also get a knob, a faceplate, Caig DeOxit, and our special adjustment/cleaning tool and all this is packaged in a professional manner. Now isn’t that the way to go? Create a quality product, by DJs for DJs at a value for money price.

How are you tackling mixers without VCA curve controls? Is there any plan to make the Pro X Fade compatible with such mixers?

Siya – In fact the cut in time can be manually adjusted but of course this DOESN’T mean the fader will make your mixer’s cut in time as sharp without curve control. However due to the manual adjustment feature you should be able to get an improved cut than previously possible.

Paul - The fader we have developed has been made to a resistance value of 50 kOhms with a linear rate of resistance, this addresses most mixers that are VCA controlled. Non-VCA mixers have been fitted with our 50kOhm fader with varying results. Most of the non-VCA mixers we fitted the fader to (Gemini, Numark etc.) have previously been fitted with a 20kOhm fader. This resulted in the cut being sharper than the user was previously used to.
This would be useful for users of older mixer types of the above-mentioned manufacturers who do not have the option of contour curve.
As I stated earlier most VCA mixers use a 50kOhm fader so our product will work with most of the VCA mixers on the market (Vestax, Stanton, Allen & Heath) with no problem. However many non-VCA mixers have different types of faders fitted, faders are available in many different types of resistance rates.
Some may use a 20kOhm fader, some a 100khm fader. Because they direct audio through the fader itself rather than a Voltage controlling an amplifier (hence VCA: voltage controlled amplifier) these tend to use a logarithmic fader. An example of the differences between the types of resistance rates:
- A linear fader will give a steady increase of resistance along the whole length of the fader or to show it mathematically, 50 kOhms over say a length of 50mm = 1kohm increase each millimeter.
- A logarithmic fader increases the rate exponentially or to put it mathematically, for a set amount of movement, the resistance will double therefore it will increase to 2 Ohms, then 4kOhms, then 8kOhms, until it reaches the full 50kOhm.
This means that if you put in a linear fader in place of a logarithmic fader the curve will be a lot sharper at first then become really slow up to the full fade. This however does not mean that versions cannot be produced with logarithmic curves; it just makes things a lot more complicated.
This is the reason why until the fader has been tested fully in other mixers such as the Technics we cannot guarantee the operation of the fader within that type of mixer.

Will you be making mods for mixers like Technics’ SHDJ, and will those be publicly released through the site?

Siya - A mod isn’t the solution for the Technics SHDJ mixers. If there is a demand we will produce a fader with the correct resistance values for the SHDJ range and possibly the Rane 52-54 range as well.

John - Product development is a continuous process. All mixers will be reviewed to see if we can produce a compatible product, on the assumption that it is commercially viable.

Will you still be offering a choice of different knobs and colours?

Siya - We’ll be asking all your readers this… What do you guys wanna see? I know a lot of them will want the square type knobs but as the Pro X Fade has an 8mm shaft this causes issues such as the size and feel of the knob. We actually got one tooled up but found it was too Lego like! (ed note: if you want to email in feedback about the Pro X knob, then please send it to this address. Please keep the emails relevant).

Why did you choose to use Caig Deoxit as the lube/cleaner for the fader?

Mike - It’s simple, we chose Caig, because it’s the best!! We’ve been using Caig on our other faders and motor faders for over ten years now, and it hasn’t let us down. Deoxit cleans and lubes, however, it’s produced in a way that it is not harmful to the conductive plastic tracks. The management team at Caig really know their stuff, and the products they sell, are manufactured with audio applications in mind. The squeeze tube idea is great, and ideal for the retail market and for the mixer manufacturers to include with their products.

John - Most of our customers on standard faders have had good experience with Caig. Caig have been extremely helpful in choosing the right product.

Siya - We actually first had the blue MCL lube in mind but that’s just a lube and then Caig put us onto the Deoxit, some heavy duty lube and cleaning shiznit!

Are you trying to ensure an even price across the board? I’m thinking for example that at the moment the pound is much stronger than the dollar for example, so that if prices were ‘equal’ it could be cheaper for a UK head to buy in the US with the exchange.

John - This is any manufacturer’ nightmare. It is impossible to control. There are distinct markets differences between the USA and UK, even inner-State since sales taxes are different. One major disadvantage in the UK and mainland Europe is the high VAT level. Immediately there is a 17.5% difference. Shipping to the USA is cheaper.
However, if there is a perceived price difference it would be soon eradicated if people tried to buy from say the USA, by the time shipping, duty and VAT is added then the price difference (if any) would be very little.

What will the distribution be like when you launch the product?

Mike - We have had huge interest in the Pro X Fade. Our first step and the logical and safe one to make is to first concentrate on the UK markets, where we can service and support immediately. It’s easy to jump in the car and go on tour, promoting through demonstrations and in-store gigs. The website shop will be up and running and thus the fader can also be purchased from here as well.

Will it be worldwide from the go, or will you work towards that?

Mike - The power of the internet makes the Pro X Fade a global product immediately. We are researching and talking to various worldwide retailers and this will take time. At first, we will be picking some key retail partners to work in each country and we can then expand from there on. The key thing about the Pro X Fade is that ideally we do not want to go along the distribution route. We want to sell direct to retailers and in this way, the final selling costs will be kept down.

Beyond the Pro X Fade, any future products in store?

Siya - Line Faders.

So there you have it. Ultimately the final decision can only be made by you the users, with the product in hand, either through buying or testing it in a shop. I’d like to thank all at EB, Seltron and TKD for letting us bring you such in depth coverage of their new product and for being so open with us and allowing to do this. It is too common nowadays for manufacturers to ignore their direct market and feed it press releases and marketing hype so it’s nice to see people like EB willing to break the cycle. Even if you don’t agree with their claims or think that the product doesn’t deliver what it said it would, ultimately they’ve proven that they meant it when they said they would open up the whole process behind it. Thanks also go to Deft and Gizmo at Skratchworx for their help and to all who put up questions on the forums.
As we’ve already mentioned you can check a review of the Pro X Fade over at Skratchworx and you can also purchase one from the newly opened Skratchshop, as well as from the Eclectic Breaks website in the coming weeks, post PLASA. You can also check a series of other reviews from European sites including T-Turn in Italy, Hand-Control in France, reviews that should be online within a month. Stay tuned to the EB site for more news on the line faders as well as other EB projects, including a series of break records and scratch tools from the likes of 2tall and Daredevil. Lastly keep your eyes on the Turntable Radio site for a special Pro X giveaway!