Circadian writings, an interview with Giant and Hentsix

Giant and Hentsix are two DJs from the US who have recently released an album, entitled Circadian Rhythmz on Illegal Fetish records. Since being released the album has been making waves in the turntablist/scratch music scene, with many people picking it as one of their favourite albums from 2003. Following an encounter with Mr Trick from Turntable Radio, we were lucky enough to catch a copy and arrange an interview with the guys about the album, music and the musical aspect of taking a dump. After some slight delays the interview is ready and also followed by a review of the album, (the interview was done by email separately, as they both live in different parts of the country). Kick back and enjoy...

First things first, can you tell us who you are, where you are from and how long you been into turntablism/DJing?

Hentsix: I go by the name of Hentsix, I'm of Italian nationality (grew up in Syracuse, Sicily), been living in the states for 4 years now, in Dayton, Ohio. I've been actively involved in turntablism for a little under 3 years now, but my love for music dates back to birth.

Giant: I'm Nick Venaglia aka GIANT and I'm from Albuquerque New Mexico, Usa. I have been into this whole djing thing for about 4 years.

How did you two meet?

H: We met online... Snatchcon and D-Styles's boards was the place, after that we started talking on instant messenger and came to realize we shared the same views and had similar ideas as well as styles of cutting and production, so that's how it all started.

G: Yup, both of us were posting tracks on those message boards and we really dug each other's work so we started talking on aim.

We always ask this to everyone we speak to. What would be your definition of turntablism?

H: The word "Turntablist" in my opinion is simply a variant terminology for "musician". I know that the overall accepted definition (as Babu defined it) is "someone who has mastered all the aspects that involve the turntable, whether it is battling, mixing, rockin' a crowd, cutting or whatever..." but the way I perceive turntablism is something deeper than a methodology and goes way beyond technicality and approach to the mean; said in one word its "music", but the depth of this word is hard to be verbally expressed. Being able to transmit everything that is within you, memories, feelings, fear, or a mixture of all the above... it becomes something so intensively personal. Every time you record something or showcase something it's a piece of yourself being presented to the public, and the fact that you can record it transforms it into a document of your inner frame of mind and status. Its like having sex for the first time and being able to re-experience that exact feeling over and over again... some of you might think I'm a little too extreme but...

G: Turntablism to me is just the word that describes the art of mixing, scratching, juggling, and everything that has to do with hip hop DJing.

The concept behind your CD ‘Circadian Rhytmz' is very interesting as well as being genuinely refreshing for a scratch/turntablist album. How did you come up with it, what was the motivation behind it?

H: The concept came together by itself. The reason why it was an easy project overall for us (at least conceptually) is because the main purpose was to produce something personal. The cd was specifically recorded for personal satisfaction in the first place. We never meant to produce something for people, even though apparently a lot of people dig it now, but it was something very spontaneous. It is the result of a collaboration that is very epidermic, by this I mean that every sound is the result of a feeling or experience; we both have a conception of music as "life-experience", therefore the tracks came together almost naturally, ... we just kind of forced ourselves to isolate single emotions or combined specific emotions into separate tracks. After realizing that the way we were producing, scratching and recording the tracks almost created a natural flow, we decided to complete the circle. Circadian Rhythmz is basically the soundtrack to an average day in our life, from when you get up to when you go to bed... if you listen carefully you can identify those specific moods and somehow relate to them. Sticking to the theme wasn't a problem at all, just a matter of deciding what hadn't been musically painted yet... I think we did leave out certain moments of our day just because they weren't as intense or maybe couldn't have been properly represented...I still want to make a track about taking a crap but it would probably end up being a 20 minute track cos' its such a deep feeling, maybe we'll make an EP for it!  

G: What he said...haha. But really once we got started with the cd, everything just flowed. We trashed a few tracks but for the most part it was easy to stick to the concept.

Would you consider doing similar projects again, working with people in other places?

H: The fact that we never met before actually kind of stimulated the process, along with the fact that this type of shit has never really been done before, or at least not too often. Not knowing what the other's usual everyday life was like kind of made the procedure even more interesting. Its as if I could take Giant into my life for 3/4 minutes and vice-versa. We slowly build a cross-existence, creating part of a day in the life of a person who never existed, whose life is the result of a dual parallel existence, Giant's and mine! We had to put up with a lot of hassle cos' of internet connection problems and shit like that, but it was a dope experience, its like at the end of the day I would come home and be like "Let's see what type of shit Giant went thru today". Its sort of like a musical voyeurism if you look at it from a certain point of view, makes it even more tempting. We are currently working on sum new shit, a new jazz-oriented EP, and a 5-movements introspective concerto... so actually Circadian Rhythmz expanded from being a single project to a collective of projects based on the same principle, but its like getting to know more about what you heard before every time. Its like expansion packs! The composition process basically consisted in sending back and forth stuff to each other; I would lay some shit down, send it to Giant, he would lay more on top, send it back, and keep on building like that, from zero to finished track, 50/50 production, cuts, effects, structuring etc... Our main concern was to be fully satisfied about each track and create something unique.

G: For me Turntablism has definitely helped out a lot in my production. I have taken so many ideas and sounds from juggling and scratching and applied it to making music. Either adding actual aspects of tablism into my tracks or imitating techniques and sounds on produced tracks.

Do you find that your turntablist knowledge and experience helps you with your musical productions? If so which aspects of turntablism do you think come through the most in your productions?

H: Knowledge is at the base of everything, if you don't have it you're an empty envelope... I have expanded my views and capabilities a lot through this shit, and it really gave me the chance to put down my feelings, thoughts and ideas in a more concrete way, to depict a lot more aspects of what I had in mind. Basically it's like conducting my own fuckin' orchestra and playing each instrument at the same time. Also gaining more knowledge as I go gives me the chance to keep on elevating my status and not fossilize in one standardized sound, I try to keep my shit as dynamic as I can, every project different from the previous, there is so much stuff that can be done that repetition to me is not even a concern, or option for that matter.

G: I feel I'm stronger at producing but I love turntablism. It's a lot of fun to just cut and mix. So I'd say both of them are equally enjoyable.

What do you enjoy the most production or turntablism?

H: Production and turntablism go hand in hand. By this I mean that I mainly focus on turntablism as a production method, re-production (live performance of something I previously recorded), or simply a combination of the two. My main purpose, ever since I seriously got into it, was music, therefore the approach I have is in that direction. My way of producing is strictly dictated by my skills in turntablism; the more I advance in it, the more I will be able to put together better and more interesting music; of course listening to well produced shit stimulates my brain to challenge myself even more. I'm really big into jazz, blues and experimental shit in general, so that's where my main inspiration comes from, even though I come from a real various musical background that goes from classical to speed/doom/trash metal... but at the same time you cant really get into something specific too much, you always have to be your biggest fan, or you'll end up biting somebody else's style, that's just a fact.

Have you been working on other projects since Circadian Rythmz?

H: As I mentioned before we are currently working on new material, but there is nothing completed yet.

G:Yeah... We're always making beats and scratching, but nothing yet is completed.

What do you think of recent turntablist productions such as D-Styles LP, Wave Twisters etc...? Do you see your work fitting more within that sphere of the turntablist artform?

H: Certainly those releases have influenced me a lot, along with Ricci Rucker's works. The bar keeps on getting raised and the intensity of the musical experience gets stronger. Some of these works is partially the reason I decided to even start doing what I'm doing today, and what keeps on motivating me to do so. I definitely see my work along the same lines as these mentioned productions, and by this I mean that the attitude and approach is somewhat similar even though the result is so different, and that's what's great about music ... but at the same time I don't even fuckin' dare comparing my shit to the above listed works, I still have a very long way to go!!!

G: Word. Those albums have had a lot of impact on me! Wave twisters, along with d-styles Pharaohs of Funk cd, were the first tablist cds I had heard that made we want to start scratching and producing. Phantazmagorea and Scetchbook also have influenced me a lot and shown me the capabilities of using just a turntable to make music.

Have you heard of scratch notation systems (such as the ones developed by John Carluccio and A-Trak)? If so what is your opinion of them, do you use them at all? Or do you use similar mnemonic systems?
Hentsix: Being classically trained, what do you think of the way that turntablism is trying to establish a notation system, which in a sense is a way for the practitioners to be recognised as valid musicians by the mainstream of music? 

H: I personally don't use the scratch notation system simply because currently I am more interested in developing new patterns and overall in a more melodic approach; I usually try to remember the way my phrases sound, as if I were speaking through cuts. Basically I see myself still at a "hearing" level, still learning my theoretical aspect of this specific instrument, even though I studied music for a long time. I don't think it is necessary to establish a written notation in order to demonstrate and prove the validity of the turntable as an instrument, as a matter of fact scratch musicians have an approach to music very similar to jazz or blues, based on improvisation and jamming, without previously established schemes or scales... its an instantaneous correspondence between the musician and the instrument. As of right now I think every musician is actually trying to establish their own sound and not focusing in reproducing somebody else's material. There is so much more to explore and try within this genre that I think it is a little early to start mimicking. Also we have the convenience and availability of audio/video recordings, a 20th century version of notation, which was basically invented in order to convey musical pieces to future generations. I'll be damned if I see album releases entitled "D-style's covers A thru Z" or "Scetchbook Revisited in A minor".

Have you heard of the concerto for turntable that DJ radar has put together, and if so what are your thoughts on it?

H: I think it is a very interesting concept as well as composition, it presented the artform in a new perspective, ... I don't feel like I am in the position to truly critique or criticize, but it represents a great achievement.

What do you think of orchestrated turntablism, and DJ Bands (such as Grasshoppa Big Band and Ned Hoddings)? Is that something you would be interested in, with each DJ fulfilling a place within the band?

H: Orchestrated composition or performing is yet another example of the jazz-oriented approach, and by "Jazz-Orientation" I don't mean the sound of it, but the ethic behind the act itself. It doesn't necessarily need to sound like jazz, or have saxophones, tubas and pianos; the jazz mentality goes way beyond the traditionally recognized sound, it is a way of performing consisting in alternating solos, breakdowns, progressive build-ups and drop-downs, drastic tempo changes  (double/triple timing) and in synthesis a dramatically dynamic execution. Don't be fooled by the "sound" of what you hear, its the way it is performed that makes it good or bad music.
I definitely see this as the future of live performances involving turntables, because it keeps the artform genuine and at the same time stimulating, challenging and "musical". A lot of products nowadays are focused on technicality and lack flavor, musicality and soul. In order to be part of a band (whether scratch-based or not) you have to FEEL the music, and contribute to its fulfillment, therefore your technicality, flavor, improvisation and natural rhythm skills are challenged at the same time, along with each other member. When those skills come all together and there is a mutual understanding that's when MEN GIVE BIRTH TO MUSIC AND MUSIC BECOMES THOSE MEN.   

G: I think DJ bands are great. Much of the motivation behind the ‘all scratch' albums of today has been the want to perform the recorded songs live and yes, I would love to start performing live, especially in a dj band. !!!!

Do you guys use any digital technology in your work/productions? Have you tried Final Scratch and other similar systems? What do you think of them, and the way that digital technology seems to develop around the DJ/turntablist and not the other way round?

H:We limit ourselves to use multi-tracking software, and even within that we try to keep it as scheme-less as possible. I personally use CEP for the sole reason that it doesn't force me to think in terms of bars, grids, buttons or patterns... I basically record by layers organizing my shit across the screen as I want to, there's not much synthetic pre-imposed structuring, and it gives me more freedom of variation and inventiveness. Once again though it is a personal preference, I am not trying to knock on any other editing/production software, I just feel more comfortable. As far as electronic/digital technology goes, I try to stick with a more human approach to music, I don't like productions that sound too mechanical, it kind of takes away that human and individualistic feel of it. Most of the times I record straight out of the platter arranging my shit as I go... there's way too much reliance on digital apparatuses nowadays, from loopstations to sequencers, that's good for practicing and such, but I find it hard to get into musical composition done with those means, it's way too predictable, I like music that keeps you guessing and interested, and I truly believe that there is no room for that in automated sequencing programmed production.

G:Acid 4.0 is about all the technology I use for my music, not to say I'm against technology, rather I'm a poor college student that cannot afford that shit. I really would like to get final scratch or a cd deck to scratch samples from mp3s, TV and movies. For the most part I like sampling records for instrument sounds, so I don't see a cd deck taking over all of my production needs, but rather using it for word samples and stuff.

What about the battling scene? Is that something that appeals to you, and if not could you tell us why? Do you think that in more recent years there is a certain stagnation on the battle scene as there hasn't been any major revolutions in turntablist techniques (such as scratching etc...) as there have been throughout the 90's?

H: Honestly I never got into the battle scene that much, I thought it was cool and all, I liked some of mid/late 90's battle routines, but I soon came to realize that the battle scene was doomed to stagnate. There's too much of an imposed standard in it. You have to follow a certain degree of guidelines in order to place decently and that kind of bothers me. Lately also there's too much of the jiggy aspect in it, people expect you to juggle beats they know, do your lil' 1 minute cuts routine, then feedback routine and blah blah blah... and there's too much politics and bias-based judging. Once again that's just personal. I have never had a competitive view of music anyways, and most of these routines are not even musical in the first place, so sure it requires technicality and skills to rock a x-fader back and forth with your umbilical cord and still be on beat, but that's not what I'm interested in. I'm more concerned with music making than anything else, at least as of right now.

G: Battles, well I used to really love battles when I first got into DJing! But I now I couldn't really care less for them.

Who would be your top 3 DJs of all time?

H: D-Styles, Ricci Ruckerand Mike Boo/Toadstyle

G:D-Styles, Q-Bert and Excess/Ricci Rucker

Is there anybody in the turntablist scene today whose work inspires you or that you would really like to work with?

H:The above mentioned, I would truly love to get to work with a lot of live musicians as well, and expand my knowledge of instrument-playing as well as performing skills.

G: D-Styles, Ned Hoddings, and 2 Tall

Where do you see turntablism in 10 years?

H: It is hard to predict, there are so many different directions yet to be taken and so many perspectives yet to be even conceived that the possibilities are infinite; just as long as those who are doing their thing and truly dedicate themselves and put their heart and soul in it keep on doing so, and more and more people realize what has been achieved and keep on building on top of that I think the future will be productive... it's insane what's been done only over the last couple of years, if the musical growth keeps following the same curve-line it will be seriously dope. We just have to keep evolving around creativity and inventiveness, without that we're only destined to repetition.

Is there a website where people can find out more about you guys? And where can people find the CD?

H: We are currently working on an ILLEGAL FETISH RECORDS website (the label we're releasing our shit under) As of right now you can get in touch with us trough email, or on the boards, but the site should be ready soon and will be somewhat similar to the surprise content of the packages, those who have bought the cd straight out of our website know what I'm talking about so... more food for the eyes! 
To order the cd just go to www.ungratefulgrandchild.com/cr
Scroll down to the bottom and select one of the 2 paypal options, international or US orders. Or just send a money order to the address listed. Be on the lookout for our new shit to drop, and thanks.

Circadian Rhythmz review

Giant and Hentsix's new album/EP is by far one of the most interesting CDs I have heard all year, and even for a long time actually. Circadian rhythms are a part of people's biological clocks, which are slightly imperfect and which rhythms' do not follow an exact pattern and are therefore circadian. Using this concept/theme Giant and Hentsix built their album so that "every track symbolically represents a mood... and the album is supposed to be heard as a whole, and represents the synthesized mood swings through which an artist goes within a 24 hour span..."

The cd itself is really refreshing for a scratch music album and works really well on its own, but within the bigger picture of its underlying theme, I find that it can have even more impact on the listener. This is not just your average scratch album, with a few tracks, some recognisable beats and two guys scratching in an anal-retentive manner. The album shows that they have their own style and are able to break away from the mould and not follow what everyone else is doing. They have produced something that is able to stand on its own amongst all the mass of scratch produced or scratch based music out there, and even amongst most popular music released today.

The production on the album was equally shared between both DJs and listening to the album it seems like the work of one mind, not something that was shared and put together by two separate people, and what is more two people that live in different parts of the USA and never met each other.

The overall feel of the album is definitely quite dark but it works well and the inherent musicality of the pieces Giant and Hentsix have put together shines throughout the album. Vocal samples are present on most tracks but not overdone and they do not take away from the compositions of which they are a part of. There are some great samples on the album and they are really well put together adding to the themes and moods of the tracks as well as managing to raise a few eyebrows (especially the Japanese sounding woman who talks about blood drinking). And for the sample spotters and anoraks out there, a few of the chosen samples are recognisable from other recent and not so recent productions.

After a few listens the theme of circadian rhythms becomes more apparent and adds to the music as you try and relate the track to a mood. Another highlight of the album is the way in which the scratches have been done and used. They add just the right amount to the moods Giant and Hentsix create and form an integral part of the compositions, instead of being its focus or being too overpowering. This is scratch music without being full of itself or trying too hard. In a time where it is easy for many DJs or tablists to produce compositions where scratching is omnipresent and overpowers everything else, Giant and Hentsix have managed to strike a perfect balance in their productions, something which is another feat for a first release. The only real downside to this album is the fact that it isn't longer! At 30 minutes long, as soon as it ends you feel like you want more, and that is something the guys will hopefully rectify with their next outing.

So all in all this is a great album that deserves your money and time and which hopefully will also herald the beginning of a fruitful career for both Giant and Hentsix. These guys are talented and this shows it, and the album even manages to rekindle your faith and belief in scratch music. Scratch music might not be something a lot of people think exists just yet, but this is a push and stride in the right direction, and as with some of the other productions that have come out this year, this album pushes the listener a bit more then just your average scratch based album, making you think and feel not just listen.

Thanks go out to Mr Trick for passing us the CD and helping with the hook up, and Giant and Hentsix for their time. Since this interview, Giant & Hentsix released their second EP, entitled Welcome to Last Week, and which is also available from the ungratefulgrandchild website. You can also check www.turntableradio.com to listen to tracks from both these EPs (check the archive section).